Recently, we saw a fellow towing a 31-foot Airstream Classic with a minivan.
The Classic is the heaviest Airstream model. The 31-footer weighs about 10,000 pounds.
Does this seem like a wise combination to you?
A friend recently send me a photo of someone towing a 25-foot Airstream with a Saturn sedan. Wow, towing a 25-footer with a Saturn? I am impressed — and concerned.
Without running a numerical analysis, I’m immediately concerned about the stability of that rig. I don’t know the exact wheelbase and weight of the Saturn, but one must wonder how the rig handles on a windy day. What about the braking distance?
A secondary issue is the impact & wear upon the transmission of that tow vehicle. Would you want to buy that Saturn? I suspect the transmission is toast. This is why you should have an inspection performed when buying a used vehicle. But back to the more pressing issue of SAFETY…
Towing recommendations factor in a margin of safety for adverse conditions. If you are MAXING OUT the capacity of your tow vehicle, there’s little to no margin of safety when things go wrong. Suppose the wind picks up, or you have to make a sudden emergency maneuver. That’s when the combo gets dangerous. Accidents happen. People get killed. There’s much gnashing of teeth!
Just because something is possible, that doesn’t mean it’s a good idea. Those old images of people towing Airstreams with bicycles are not meant to be taken literally. 😀
I’m not trying to be Debbie Downer here. To me, choice of tow vehicle is a safety issue. I want people to enjoy camping safely. You know, “arrive alive” and all that jazz. Pushing the limits of a tow vehicle / RV combination might seem fine. It might work 99% of the time. Then the 1% happens, and it becomes a disaster.
Think about it this way. Suppose you have to make a sudden lane change at 70 MPH on a steep downhill grade in a stiff cross-wind? Would you feel safe? You want to be in complete control of your rig at all times.
Please make certain your tow vehicle can SAFELY handle whatever RV you choose.
Must be a Quebec thing. We were recently in Flagstaff at the KOA and I saw a 34′ Triple Axle. I wanted to say hello but no one was out. I looked at their tow vehicle and almost c****** my pants. It was a Buick Enclave! I would be a bit nervous trying a 34′ with my tow vehicle (essentially a Seymore clone) let alone an Enclave. Although he DID have a Hensley hitch.
I will pass on that one, and never forget it.
Forgot to mention the Quebec link. The trailer was from Quebec.
LOL… Maybe it is a Quebec thing. We shot this video clip in Quebec, right outside Montreal.
I can only imagine what that’s like on a windy day. The phrase “tail wagging the dog” comes to mind!
Hummmm …. that is a bit scary. I wonder if they at least have a Hensley setup. Can Am RV in London Ontario are proponents of this type of apparent mismatch (see pictures at bottom of this page: http://www.canamrv.ca/Home/Hidden/TestDrive/tabid/16700/Default.aspx )
but I think they might even blink at this one. Andy Thompson of CanAm has written lots about towing with different types of vehicles. Some articles HERE: http://www.rvlifemag.com/hitchhints.html
I assume most of you have seen this combination: http://www.paushe.com/toyotasequoia
Anyway, I guess the bigger, heavier and more powerful tow vehicle you can afford makes the best sense. My setup isn’t quite what I would like to be honest but I have been assured it’s safe and that as long as I don’t go ripping down the Interstate at 90 MPH I will be fine. I’ll report back in 5 months 🙂
I guess to be fair, it does depend on intended usage. I mean, if someone’s towing their RV down the street, they can use a lawnmower for all I care. 🙂
But once you get out there on the major interstates, traffic picks up, everything happens at faster speed, and the limits get tested. The downside risk of exceeding the limits here is pretty extreme. I’ve heard a few horror stories of totaled rigs…and worse.
I’m thinking about hauling butt across New Mexico…. or climbing steep grades in Montana. Not only would this setup torch the transmission of the tow vehicle, in an emergency situation it could become unwieldy and dangerous.
If you ever really take a look at the statistics on highway deaths in North America, the numbers are staggering. Over 40,000 people die in the United States annually on the highways. It’s like a Vietnam War happening every year, in terms of body count. Things have gotten better as auto safety has improved, but it’s still extremely dangerous. So there’s no need to take additional chances.
To state the obvious, it’s best to err on the side of caution when you are towing. No ripping down the Interstate at 90 MPH! (Restless, aren’t you a former police officer, ha ha…) Seriously, one thing I strangely enjoy about towing an RV is that speeding is not really an option. There’s no point in hurrying along. It’s pretty rare that I exceed a posted speed limit while towing our Airstream.
See it all the time.. and yep we see the results also down the way as road kill. It used to be that airstream would suggest that you get a vehicle to tow with.. but they since stopped… something about… we only sell trailers… and don’t care what you pull it with…(all about the money I guess)
The car dealers have little to offer the RV’r who goes in and asked what should I get… if I am pulling a trailer… again… no real technical experteese… and so most head on over to the TOY department and buy something that the dealer said would do the trick… We noted that Toyota will not honor their warrantee in some cases unless you have a trans cooler installed… (yep been their done that) but, Toyota doesn’t sell a trans cooler from the factory or dealer.. only after market.. and those are not elgible for approval.. so its a catch 22 issue…
Some of the better reading material is the FORD, Chevy, Dodge towing guide… I know Ford puts out a new one yearly and you can down load it or get them to send it to you for free just for the asking… a good idea.. but, a lot of people don’t like american made anymore.. or at least made in the motor city… so instead they opt for them little toys that really show nicely on the adds… (ever notice why toyota quit say’n that they were better… well.. guess why… they weren’t but, how many people bought them thinking.. they made the right choice because of the add…hmmm 😀
Besides your right Sean.. you could tow a airstream with a bike… but, what you really need is good brakes… and stopping it once its going down hill with a bike is not where you want to be… I think they called the last guy to try it… FILL… as the trailer will run you over in a blink of an eye.. if it can get away and no breaks….I don’t care what kind of trailer hitch you have… your going to put all that weight and stress on them their vehicle brakes your riding in… does it happen.. yep.. been their done that… as we say 🙂 broken wire…
Yet people risk all they own for a little extra gas mileage with the toy tow vehicle… and yes if you check your right.. a lot don’t go RV’n any more from the grave yard…
But, do they listen.. nada… they know what is best for them… and so go toddling off blissfuly.. until the unexpeced happens and then they want to sue someone for their ignro-ance but hopefully by then .. too late and the gean pool got a little shallower…
Now some even say a PU is not the best vehicle to pull a trailer with… again were talking stopping here… as a empty bed pu has very little weight over the rear axles… and so if the trailer pushes.. and the only tires doing the stopping are the fronts…on the PU… then you can see how a term called jack knifing happens… that 6,000 lbs behind the PU has to bleed the energy off somewhere and if you hit the binders.. and it doesn’t have its brakes working… it puts it all into the tow ball…hitch… and as the PU then starts to stop using the front wheels (more due to engine and pax weight.) one can visualize what happens to the buckling effect of pushing the back of the truck around or even up as a moment of energy… and then the trailer runs over the truck…
People have no idea today of the energy and moments that a 6-9000 lb mass can exert… most find out just a little to late.. but those that have experianced and recovered… take a while and lots of coffee to calm back down and get back on the road again…
The last incident we saw was a 34 foot Airstream towed by a TUNDRA pu truck… we were coming down the divide… and doing our slow.. decent giving our BIG FORD PU… time to allow for cooling the brakes on both the trailer (ours is 25 ft) and the PU… the Tundra flashed his light and pass’ed us on the flat… and started down the grade… we could already smell our brakes.. sooo we slowed down and used the engine to help… but we noticed that he was hitting a lot of brake.. (stop lights on almost constantly) Then it happend… smoke from under the trailer .. and I made the comment.. thats not good… they increased in speed away from us.. and we lost sight of them… until we got about 7 miles down the road where it makes a 90 deg curve around the hill… yep their they were… the truck was smashed into the embankment.. the airstream had rolled off the back of the truck and over the guardrail and bank… and had caught on fire down the hill as it spread its contents along the way…
Saddly to say the couple who were in the PU… were pin’d in and killed when it impacted the embankment… the truck was dam near bent in half… and it too was on fire…from under the engine …
Speculation says that the trailer brakes went out… ya they probably worked right up till we saw them start smoking… then they only had the truck brakes which probably lasted another mile or so.. not being able now to stop the unit accelerated down the hill… till they lost control and the trailer probably pushed the truck into the hill side… compressing the truck and killing them… at that point it appears the trailer contenued sheading its energy… breaking the hitch off the truck and glancing off the PU it then vaulted over them.. jumping the guard rail and next stop bottom of the caynon… where the propane ignited and set fire to what was left…
Cause of the accident.. basically not knowing the limits of the vheicles… and going too fast… and as the Highway officer said… that is why they post the 45 mph down grade signs… and had runaway break outs down a little lower.. Had they made it to it however, he said it appeared that their speed at impact was in excess of 85 mph… and they would not have saved them either…
Now you want to tow with a what??? Remember its the mass moment that gets ya… and that aint’ the trailer hitch which will save ya no matter how good it is…
Quite frankly Sean… we have seen it all to often in our travels… and hope that someday the government will put a stop to this needless carnage… on the road… they need to require a proper weight vehicle… to tow a proper weight item… it not be the acceleration but the stopping we would like to see enforced… and of course the education of the RV drivers … who think they can beat the laws of physics…
Is it the RV industry’s responsibility… or the nut behind the wheel?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=56XL0TysIn0
but if it were built for the car……
lol Bama, in that case the 5th wheel was made for the bug, err, car…
Thanks GMAs for sharing that harrowing and sad story. That’s the kind of tragic situation of which everyone needs to be aware. It happens all the time. Like I said, if the body count was happening in a war overseas, we’d see it on the evening news every night. But it’s happening on our own highways, so everyone takes it for granted. These days the only highway casualties that really get reported are the unusual ones, when large numbers of people are killed in one accident. The smaller numbers of deaths don’t even get reported. Then you look at the end-of-year statistics and the total body count is staggering.
At this point we’ve towed our Airstream from Key West to Maine to Seattle to San Diego. We’ve criss-crossed the country. Even in the “flat” areas like Kansas and Florida you sometimes deal with high winds. In the mountainous areas like Montana and Colorado you deal with steep grades. As you vividly illustrate in your story, sometimes the DOWNGRADES are the most dangerous. Some of those inclines and declines literally last for miles.
Even with our F250 there have been some challenging downgrades. We’ve got the tow package (that provides AWESOME engine braking) but there still have been times when I’ve felt the push of 8000 pounds on the back of our rig. If the brakes failed, you would have a nightmare situation.
In the case of the minivan/Airstream Classic combo, that’s a recipe for disastrous failure from the start. It’s kind of like jumping on a Yamaha motorcycle with no helmet and accelerating to 150 MPH. Sure, you may survuve it just fine. But suppose you don’t?
In general, I favor the freedom of consenting adults to engage in unwise potentially personally harmful behavior, free of government interference. I’m sort of libertarian in that respect. But in this case, the potential harm goes beyond the individual and extends to the safety of OTHERS on the road. I mean, would you want to be on the road next to this guy, when he has to make a sudden lane change or tackle a steep downgrade? Every day people are killed due to the negligence and poor judgments of others.
I totally understand and support the instinct for frugality — but not when safety is compromised. We only (to my knowledge) get one life on earth, and it’s senseless to risk it in order to save a few dollars. And besides, there’s no shortage of affordable appropriate tow vehicles on the market. Sure, you may not get the latest model with all the bells & whistles, but who cares? Just get something that’s SAFE so you can enjoy camping for years to come.
Check out this one… its a perfict example of today mindset… when it comes to towing 😀
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWE5e_H47MI&feature=related
of course you have seen this one too…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R6LdFpJXylI&feature=related
big OPS 😀 😉 😉
GMAs, wow!
The first one is sort of funny in a sad way. It’s a good example of what happens when you grossly overload a tow vehicle on a steep grade – LOL
The second video is downright scary. I’m assuming everyone survived. That video is a good reminder that we all should know the clearance height of our RV, so as to avoid any low overhangs.
These will help raise awareness of the dangers on the road… Thanks for the post!
Sean
After our first real trip with the Dakota and 26′ Travelaire (http://restlesssole.org/2009/05/28/travelaire-trailer/ ) from Goderich to Florida this October I can say this. Once we had the load leveling setup and anti sway all adjusted properly (it wasn’t done properly at the dealers) the rig was very well mannered and comfortable on the interstate. We kept our speeds low. (55 Max) and tried to foresee any breaking situations well ahead of time. Having said that I would not want to tow with our rig through any more extreme grades, up or down, than we experienced in the “Mountains” of Kentucky and Tennessee. I feel that our cushion of safety was small enough then. The 4.7 liter Dodge engine had enough power but it was the stopping and downgrades that had me more worried than anything.
If we decide to keep this setup (we’ll decide after this year) we won’t be taking it across anything like the Rockies. Just not enough of a safety margin in my humble opinion. At the very least a full size 1/2 ton would be needed to attempt anything more severe than we experienced. Preferably a 3/4 ton.
I don’t intend to frighten people, but when it comes to highway safety & towing it’s probably wise to have a little healthy fear…
Our sample video features a Toyota Sienna towing a 31-foot Airstream Classic. The Sienna, if you have the full tow package, is rated to safely tow 3500 pounds. The Airstream weighs 10,000 pounds. It doesn’t take a calculus professor to do that math! 😉
From all I have read on the subject I have come to the conclusion that the biggest safety item to have when considering tow vehicles (which seems to be lacking in many cases) is common sense. I have raced rally cars, raced motorcycles and flown airplanes all my life and I think I can “feel” a vehicle and how it’s responding to stresses in the “seat of my pants.”
I have adjusted the way I drive (of course) and my decision making when towing our trailer with the Dakota. Even so I know now that I would prefer a heavier tow vehicle than we have. We are due back home in April and we will start looking for a heavier replacement at that time. Until then, conservative driving, constant usage of all brain cells along with a healthy sense of preservation should keep us out of trouble.
I’ve enjoyed this article Sean. You’ve made people think and the only scary part was picturing that unfortunate couple in the Toyota Tundra and Airstream that GMA’s wrote about. Sorry to say but it appears that the only thing lacking in their rig was, again, COMMON SENSE!
You make an interesting point… I have also driven race cars (autocross and race track events with our local sports car club) and agree that having that sort of knowledge — about how vehicles handle at their limits — helps with all driving. Driving a race car actually made me a safer pickup truck driver! And thus a safer tower.
It does depend somewhat on where you are towing. For example, I’ve been to the highest elevation in Florida – you would laugh because it’s about as flat as it gets. But there are some steep grades out West that pose a true “torture test” to any rig. There’s a stretch of road from Yellowstone up through Montana that seems like a neverending incline! And then you get the neverending decline on the other side. I must say that having a tow vehicle with an “engine brake” is wonderful.
Anyway, great point about common sense — don’t leave home without it!